James Doran (00:06)

Hello and welcome to the ExpertPod. My name is James, your host, and today I'm joined by Natasha and her cat. We met via a podcasting guest service and they provided me your email. We're here talking, so great. If you'd like to please give an introduction on where you're from, where you've lived and what you do. Well, thanks for having me on, James. It's a pleasure to be there. Glad we got connected by VatService. It was really great.

My name and my accent are going to seal me out within 30 seconds at best. I'm originally from France, but I lived in London in pre -Brexit UK for a year. Back in 2009, I can do math and my biggest, and then I went back to France and my longest expat experience has been in the US for the past almost eight years, first in Texas and in Richmond, Virginia for the past eight years, five years.

and we'll get into the main podcast and listen how and why you with

So welcome to the podcast, welcome to section one of the podcast all about getting there. So Natasha, this is where I asked my guests a bit of the kind of reasons why they wish to move and then the how. So all the things they need to do before getting on the plane or crossing the border in order to do that. So we'll start with your kind of stint in the UK. So pre -Brexit which has been much easier because there's a lot of free movement of labor and works for students as well.

So what was the reason why you wanted to go to the UK? So I was interested in expanding my time at university because my original background was in film and media studies. So I went to professional film school in France. I had my first master from Las Hormones in film and media studies, but I kind of wanted to branch out and there it was the emergence of what we now call digital humanities.

We really did their section of technology and in hearts and humanities, whether it's archeology or, you know, video games, really a wide range. And there were a couple of options, both at UCL and at King's College London. And King's College London, this is where I ended going. That was a master in digital culture and technology, which does not even exist anymore. It was one of the really pioneering programs in that. So that was really great. That's why I decided to go.

at that time and to move. Wonderful. And were you looking at other places in the world that would offer this similar thing like the US or the universities around Europe? I really, I mean, I was already fairly fluent in English. I was kind of happy to just cross the, you know, across the channel. And I was applying for something in Canada as well, which was more of like an English immersion intensive. And I was accepted in it. I was in Vancouver, if I remember. And when I told them, well, I need to

change because I was accepted at King's College. We're like, congratulations. We were refunding you. That's fine. And I was just like, that's excellent customer service. I'm bowed to that. Very Canadian of them, just saying, sorry, how's your money back? Me being a stereotypical Canadian, how long with that process? Was it just like a normal, you applied six months before the university started or what was it like doing it from abroad?

That was fairly easy because yeah that was the application I had to take the TOEFL test since I was not a native English speaker which was so funny and I'll get more into it but like let's just say that the minimum score to go into a UK university compared to a US one was vastly different it's like you can go into the high score UK you will be fine going scoring for a US university let's not say that

I don't really see the benchmark is much higher in the UK than the US. Yeah, it was like I had to have a 110 out of 120 and it was a 70 out of 120 when I went to the US. I'm not gonna make a comment like that because you know I've already been vocal about my British and American English differences but I'm not even so much regular English so I'm a maths and physics brain so English was never my strong point. I had to kind of learn as an adult through lack of embarrassment.

Even now I still get so many things wrong. I'm asking my girlfriend for help. Like, can you, is this spelled right? Cause I don't know. Wonderful. So, so the test you did then, was that a common test you could find? Was it online? Was it at test centers? How did you have to go and take the test? The TOEFL was, was in person. I was able to take it in person in Paris because it has four votes. You may not be familiar with the TOEFL. It's a four component exam. So you have like one, one on right.

written comprehension, one on writing, a reading comprehension, writing skills, speaking skills and listening skills. And I remember I did like 113 out of 120 and it was in a cramped office in Paris. And in November, the weather was garbage. And I was just like, I was feeling off sick. I was like, can I just go home? And I was actually surprised about where I scored even though I knew my English was decent, but it was like,

Okay, I'm done. I'm happy. That was like the biggest part because, you know, going to the UK at that time, there was like no other French citizen. I didn't have any visa or anything. You know, it was, and the university did really well in terms of housing options. So that's really something I can say that was really helpful. And then, you know, I was lucky that to move there, move with a few things and my parents came with me, you know, just to...

to cross for like a long weekend to help set me up and then, you know, pick me back up at the end of the year. So I lived in, it was specific to international students. It was kind of funny because there were people from Australia, from Greece, from Canada in my home. So that was, it was kind of funny. We were like all the international stuff into one building. That was kind of funny. So overall, you know, it was better organized overall than French University because

French university is really your front of the walls. You need to figure out everything people are expecting from you. And in all my years back then, we barely had a functioning website. So going to the UK where it's like you have a university email, the sour window communication and everything. It's like, wow, I serve a French university you guys are doing. So make it so easy for me. When you applied though, was the cost of university quite high still then?

was it cheaper because it was before they changed the fees, right? Because I was the first year with the increased UK fees, which is £9 ,000 a year. But I think it was about £3 ,000. That was less than that. That was less than that because back then I did qualify for like the same as, you know, British students since it was still like the same. It was before the increase and it was also like, you're from Europe, you're from the EU. So.

Same thing, like it was people were like from Canada or Australia were paying double the price, me I was just... It was still more expensive than the French university because what is not, to be honest, what is more expensive than French university. Yeah, that was also the good thing is that it was a one -year master so that made it more affordable than a standard two -year because this one was what they consider like a taught master instead of a research master like the one I had done in France.

So it was like a higher cost, but it was also just a single year. So it's like you wrapped everything within like more or less nine months. So it made it easier in that regard. Yeah, it's true. You mean you're out of work for less time so you can go back to making money again, I suppose. That's why I did my UK's work, because it was a 12 -month master's. So I actually started working before I finished, because I'd finished my lessons and I could start working in the summer. I just write my thesis in the evenings, which is quite...

quite hard but it also made it easier for me to balance the books I suppose because being a student isn't free. Rent goes up every year. So then once you moved to the UK then you went to the US. So what was that experience like? Was it also for studying in the UK? So yes, I went back to France after the UK in which I stayed for...

Seven years, I was been back in France for about seven years and I was not planning to move to the US. Like it really happened on a whim. And because I went again, I had been struggling to find a job in France in the type of things I did. And I was actually on vacation visiting friends in Dallas in February, 2016.

And I was familiar with UT Dallas because I met a bunch of people from the arts and humanities, especially arts and technology department, during a video cam conference in Oxford years before. And a friend of mine was just like, well, you know, you could always try to apply for scholarship and get into the PhD program. Go talk to the advisor. I was just like, well, okay. I really want the in -lab.

Okay, if you're really insisting, let me go talk to her and just, you know, get over and done with it. Lovely lady. And the program was really great. I was not planning to go back to school. And they're like, well, we're basically, you know, closing scholarships and program application within two days, like two days from now. So I was just like, okay, sweet. I cobbled all of my applications and my reference letter at the last minute while on vacation on a hard functioning laptop on a friend's kitchen table.

in like less than two days. It must have made it quite easy then to decide because you usually apply or you don't because there's no time not to dwell on it really. So did you have to then go back call people back in France to send things over like documents or anything before you feature apply? What was the kind of list of things you need to do? Two big fees were actually challenging in regards that French University do not really do transcript.

That's a fun thing about France. French universities don't really do transcripts. Thankfully, UK universities do. So I was able to actually get them since it was my IOS. My latest master was from King's College London. I was able to just be like, OK, if I give you a transcript from King's College, are you fine? Yeah, we fine. Just send that over. So I was able to get it to take care of it online. But I had to retake that TOEFL, that English test. Because too much time had passed.

for it to be valid. So we had to figure out with my friend, there was one that was like a spot one hour away from where she lived next to a refuge with lions and tigers. So we made it a day adventure with me first going to go take. I didn't check. I didn't study for that test. Like I did like many years before. I just showed up or just like, okay, whatever. And I scored 114 instead of 113 years later. So I'm just like, okay, I think that's fine. And

For me, that was the only thing I had to do. I didn't really have to do anything else from France. While I was waiting, I was there purely for the application. Then it was finishing my vacation, going back to France and wait a couple of months to see if I got a bite, which I did. That's incredible. So you've been accepted then to the university. What was your next process? How long did you have before you had to move? Not much.

First of all, I was really grateful because I knew with my credentials and my experience that getting into the program was not going to be an issue. My main issue was, am I going to get the scholarship? Because without the full scholarship, there was no way I could afford it. But then you see, US, I was just like, no. Thankfully, I was accepted in the scholarship right before I got accepted into the program. So I was just like, okay, I'm fine. But that was, I think...

late April or early May and I had to start the beginning of August so then it was the whole sudden visa application which took a while and I was living in Britain in the west of France at that time was not in Paris so I had to prepare all my documents and get back to Paris go to the embassy and it's always super stressful because you're surrendering your passport and they have to send it back to you with your visa and you're hoping you get it in time to board your freaking plane I think I got my

passport back like five days before taking my... Cutting your phone? Yes, it was like if I could get it back, that would be lovely because I had everything set up and because I had to arrive. I started kind of mid -August but I really left for on like August 20th, July 27 or something like that because even though I was staying with a friend while I was finding you know where to live with a roommate and everything it was still like

I need enough time to just get my bearings together, you know, and, you know, set up a bank account and a lot of other, you know, basic stuff. So thankfully I got my passport again, five, seven days before I was like, okay, I can go. Yeah. But with doing a PhD, did you get funded from, was it a self -funded PhD or did you have a, a backer in terms of the research you were doing? so now in the UK, for instance, so that you can

companies would sponsor a PhD topic to do some research for them and then they would pay you a very base salary, but a salary nonetheless. So yeah, I was in full scholarship even though the full scholarship was still, you know, cutting it really close and because I had a full scholarship which was basically working as a teaching assistant for my department for my first three years while I was on site. And then I took a year off.

when I first moved after. The first three years I was on site and in these three years I worked my butt off because I had to take all my courses, do all my comprehensive exams, do my dissertation proposal and everything. So then I would only have the dissertation work left and I was able to take a year off, which was helpful because there was I think all the pandemic that happened in between.

And then I had to take student loans once I was a permanent resident to fund my last year of PhD. So when you left, was there anything you were apprehensive about before going to the US? Because it's quite far away. Did you have a house and stuff to sort out in France? Did you have all your belongings to pack up with just being a very short period of time?

Well, I was living with my parents at that time because like I said, I mean finding a job had been kind of a struggle I've been out of work for a bit. So I was living with my parents at that time. So that's they had enough space thankfully that they could not only keep my stuff but also keep my cat who was raised with her cat because on a student visa and You know teaching assistant stipend there was no way I could pay for her. So she's back now So she's one of the cats who may appear because I finally got her back

a couple years ago or three years ago now. So that was great. But yeah, that was mostly, I didn't have too many things that would kind of drop a lot of stuff. It was kind of, you know, a traveling light kind of deal. And the thing I really went there for the university because I love the university program and the people because let's be honest, going from France to Texas, it takes a lot for you to want to go to Texas.

Yeah, I haven't been. I was meant to go during 2020 for a stagdick because a friend of mine went to do his PhD in Texas as well. In Houston, not Dallas though. And we were meant to go to see all his old university friends before he got married in the UK. But sadly, the pandemic meant we weren't able to fly. I postponed my trip to Texas, but I'll probably go eventually because it's quite interesting to experience as a tourist. But I'm going to get into what it's like to live there in the next section.

Is there anything else you had to do or needed to think about before making the move from either France to the UK or France to the US? Not really from France to the UK, from France to the US. Ironically, I would say that the biggest stuff that happened was not so much when I originally left France. But for me, the biggest in terms of administrative was once I got married in 2019 was

The whole immigration process that came after from adjusting my statutes from student visa to permanent residency and all of that, all the way to becoming a citizen. I would say that was probably the biggest paperwork bureaucracy kind of deal compared to the original, you know, like I was saying, the biggest thing when I moved originally from my PhD was am I going to get my passport in time so I can take my plane? That was really the biggest thing. The whole ordeal of immigration later on.

That was a war thing. Well, I'm sure it's that in the being there section of the podcast.

Welcome back and welcome to section two of the podcast. So Natasha, this is where I try and get my guests' impressions of the new countries they've lived in compared to the old one. So let's go to the UK first. So when you moved from the parish you're living in to the UK, to London, what was that like? Had you visited before when you were younger or was it your first time visiting London in the UK? I think it was my first time. I mean, technically before I moved, I went to have

was not, it was kind of an interviewing process and or the orientation that I don't remember exactly. So I had gone once, but, I had actually never been to the, to the UK before. And so that was, I loved it. I love, I mean, at least back then I've not been in either London of Paris in a hot minute, but back then I love London where more than I love Paris, which I know is blasphemy as a French person, but I, I love the vibe more and,

So it was fun. It was kind of an adventure. I was really central London with my university. And I got also during the year to visit a couple of other places. I know I visited a friend in Bournemouth. And I don't remember it was that time or following year that I went to Brighton. And then I went to Oxford. So it was kind of like starting from there and then kind of exploring a little bit. Still staying very south.

Yeah, I mean there isn't really so much I could do on a weekend and you don't want to spend on budget. You can get a train to Liverpool for 10 pounds from Houston. But where do you stay? That's where it's going to look like. You can do a nice day trip. It's not a big city, Liverpool, but it's a very good city. I recommend it. It's where I'm from. It's where I'm trying to sell it. Being the tourist board for the...

So you'd, so you first moved. So when you, when you got your stuff over and your parents kind of went back home, what was that like? Did you have those housemates was you mentioned it was all a bunch of international students kind of guest going through a very similar experience. Did you all arrive at the same time? Very much so. I mean, it was kind of small at the same time. So I think that there was like.

I think there were more, but like the bulk of us, we were really like 15 people, I would say. So it was kind of like a smaller, it was kind of like a new building that added an open to international students. So where we were like, okay, we have extra, we need to stuff them somewhere. So it was a little bit how it worked. It was like individual, like it was all individual mini studios. I had the smallest one of them all that was kind of hilarious, but I was like, I have my own bathroom.

I know I am a microwave, I'm a happy camper, I'm fine, you know, that's that. It's the first thing to think about, do you have a ensuite? Because as a student shared bathrooms aren't sudden. Yeah, no, it was it was my own bathroom. Thankfully, that was one of the of the perks of that building was like, we had to be stuff there because we don't have to ship stuff. Completely. So then what when you first arrived, did you go?

How long was it before you started your studies? Did you have a freshers week? Not really. I mean, I've heard about those but having always been abroad kind of as a as a graduate student, it's like you just get thrown back into the first week and deal with it. So I think I arrived like roughly like the first day and I was starting the Monday or something like that. So

I vaguely remember when everybody was kind of at Lendi, we all went out like as a, to get to know each other like on the Saturday evening or something like that. And then, you know, on the Monday morning, it was kind of like, okay, we're all starting and we were all in different programs. We were all grad students, but we were all across all the schools possible at King's College. Yeah, so my post -grad was the sort of thing that was post -grad halls. And I had,

I got from Hungary, got from Greece, and I got from China myself. And I was the only one doing engineering and they're all doing different courses, which is really nice because you weren't just talking to engineers or you're a fellow political, but engineers are a certain type of person. So it's nice just not talking to the same person because that's what makes life beautiful, right? You get to mix with everyone and get different perspectives. So.

Yeah, I think it's quite, quite good that when universities think of that and go, well, actually we're not going to put you all on the same course because you'll know each other and then you'll go to the flats or apartments, the accommodations and you'll mingle that way. So it's always quite good. Yeah, it was interesting because a couple of people that I met who was also, there was at least a couple of international students in my program were in London, but we didn't leave.

in the same housing. So that was kind of fun because we would get to get together on anything but at the same time, while I was at the student hall where I live, everybody else was studying something else or people in international politics or people in engineering. Some people were in medical stuff, some were in computer science. So I think I was the only one kind of in the humanities department. So it was kind of fun like that too.

as you were saying, being able to have different conversations with different people. Completely. And then what was your experience of, is this the first time being away from home for so long or did you study far away from your parents when you were in France? No, when I studied in France I was all in the Paris area.

Did I have a one hour and enough commute? Yeah, public transportation. Yes, but I was still, I was still living in the same area at the time. What was it like being, okay, still two hours away by Eurostar. So not, not all that far that did you notice it? Did you miss things from France when you were there? Was there things that you wish you could, I guess have more of maybe a good bakery or a boulangerie perhaps?

Not really, first of all, it's kind of like going in. I knew it was, you know, a shorter, like, you know, nine, 10 months kind of deal. So for me, I didn't miss much. I mean, it wasn't that hard to go back, visit family, you know, for the holidays or something, because you're still fairly close. So for me, I was, I didn't really miss anything from France at that time. It was more like the, you know, the stage of it's really fun to be exploring something else. And it was also still Europe. So that was not, you know, going.

excuse me, on the other end of the world or anything. So I didn't really miss anything during my time in the UK. Wonderful. And how did you find the cultural differences? So obviously you think of the UK from France in a certain view. Did it live up to the expectation you had of it? When you were kind of getting used to the day to day lives of living in London? It did. I think it somewhat even exceeded. I was mostly curious going in, but

It's again, one of the things, you know, in terms of I'm not necessarily a big city kind of person. I kind of like my smaller, you know, kind of meat sized city. I would say I'm kind of a meat sized city, but I like, I kind of like the multi, the multicultural aspect of London more. I liked, it felt like a much nicer place. Again, at that time, that was, that was a while ago to just, you know, walk around and explore Van Paris. I was already kind of

on with Paris at that time. So that's why I think I also really, really like London and all the opportunities. And also there was this aspect really of discovering and I love being able to walk everywhere. You know, obviously to go from my home to university, I took the bus, but it's my university on my second semester. I had in three different locations and I was, since it was close to the Strand.

I literally was walking from one place to the other, but that meant on one day of the week, I would either arrive or leave one of the classes 30 minutes late because I needed time to walk there. And the professor were just like, yeah, that's fine. You alternate from one week to the other and everything is fine. And I love walking. So I absolutely love being able to walk to so many places. Yeah. London is, I go quite often. It's a nice place to walk. People get the tube everywhere, but I just quite like walking on the street because you see more.

I used to love the Boris bikes or the the sands on their bikes which they had because I prefer to take those because you could see more of the city for sure. Well, the cycling in London is not the safest. The driving isn't great and there's not many bike paths. It's getting better I think but definitely back in 2009 there was probably nothing.

And then in terms of socializing, obviously you were there to study, so a lot of time you spent studying, but did you find it easy throughout the year to make friends? And if so, how did you do that?

So I mostly met people that I met during my program or, you know, were living in my student hall. But I also got to meet in person like a couple of friends that I had made through an online Star Wars role -playing community. I had joined not that long before moving to the UK and two of them were living in London at the time. So that's, we got to meet up a few times. So that was...

That was cool as well. And I got to meet with a couple of other online friends I had met through other communities. So it was like, hey, you're in London or, you know, I had that friend in Bournemouth. So it was kind of like, also the other part of socializing. So it was kind of, it was kind of both. And even, you know, even if you don't stay super close friends with these people, at least you know, it's still a socialization that is fine, you know, and fun while it lasts.

Not everything is meant to be, it's a lifetime commitment or whatever, it's the rose seasons. Yeah, exactly. Completely. And friendships kind of have a shelf life, so it makes sense. It depends entirely on the circumstances. When you're a student, you've got a lot of spare time. We've got a lot of time with people. But as you get to adulthood, you don't have that freedom of time or that I could just go and spend six hours playing video games or something.

as much as we'd love to do that. We can't, unless you're a video game designer or a tester or something, that's a cool job. But you know, it's a, it's also a week we can redo with our friends. I can play volleyball for seven hours a week. I can't do that now. Otherwise I would just have nothing else to do. But the friends that you make from those kind of experiences, be it sport, be it going, going out drinking or to the night or going through online communities.

It's a luxury you have when you're a student, you're time rich and money poor. Time rich as a grad student, that depends. I had more time during my grad than my bachelor's. Generally, I had more time. I don't know how, but... Yeah, I don't know how he did either. I got lucky on my course because my friends did the integrated masters and mine was a one -year masters.

and they had more work and less time to do it, whereas I had more time and less work. This is great. I do three modules a semester and then I have a third semester for my thesis. So it was quite well -paced. Yeah, no, that was less time than that even at King's College in France in my first semester. We did not have extra time to do our thesis on top of the classwork to examine.

I had to do 120 page single space the first year and 100 page of thesis single spaced the second year. So, and all of that basically compress in nine months. So yeah. That's, I don't envy you. so then going to the States. So from, from the UK or from, from France, sorry. what was that like? Did that live up to your expectation? Obviously you went, to see some friends when you first arrived there, even to visit,

It's such a vast place and every state's got its own personality. When you went to Texas, do you live up to the expectation you have of the stereotypical Texans you think about when you're a biggest not there in Europe perhaps? I wasn't big on Texas in the first place. I mean, like it was really like the, the program that really made me want to go. And up to this day, this university has existed in Austin, I would have understood, but in Dallas, that was an overstory.

I was lucky that I had one of my closest friends who was living in Dallas for a few years already and I had visited once before. So that did help. And so she was able to introduce me to a bunch of people and everything, but I was already looking forward to get out of Texas, to be honest, because, and that was even, I mean, I moved here in 2016. So that's kind of all that there is to know in terms of politics as well. But that's...

It just, I always joke when I said something that shocked people, even if it was completely normal, I was just like, well, I'm French. And then sometime you saw that terrified look on people's face and I called my, I'm French being my get out of jail free card because people suddenly stopped talking and starting to imagine, God knows what. That was like, okay, no, I'm done. But at the same time, the university like my department and some of the professors were really, really great. We were also very international.

university that was one of the campuses that had most international students. 27 % I think we were of international students. So when we arrived at the orientation that was hilarious because it was International Orientation Day. So we were in one of the new war and theaters. And then they called, you know, people to stand up by country. So they do country and at some point Europe, five people that year.

by country until Europe when they called Europe and we were just five people. There was so two Germans, two Greeks in one French. They're starting a bad joke. So what was that like then? Did you, cause Germany, Greece and France are completely different countries and vastly different cultures. Did you still kind of, I guess,

attract to each other in terms of values? Because they're still in a shared European thread of what you expect. Or did you socialize with them at all? Or were you... I socialized with one of them briefly. She was in the neuroscience. She was a PhD student. She was from Greece. And we crossed paths a few times because I'm not exactly sure why it happened, but we crossed paths. The other three people, I wouldn't even be able to tell you their name, what they look like, or what they were studying. But also, did you... Did you... The other international students then...

Did you feel a connection with them or were you friends with a lot of locals as well or other Americans from other states? It was kind of a mixed bag of everybody. Like I think the people I most naturally connected with were the other teaching students because we were four people assigned in two sections of the same big freshman.

It was generally an undergrad class introduction to the arts. There was two sections of 100 students, mostly not from humanities. There was a lot of fun. The professor was great, but basically we were four teaching assistants during these first two years when it kind of changed in the third year. But in that group of four in the first year, there were two Americans and one was in his 60s, one was late in his 30s.

I was in my thirties too and then the fourth one was, I'd lived in the US for a while but was originally from Vietnam. So it was kind of a fun mixing, mix spot. Great. And how did you, did you kind of compare notes of when you moved to the States then in terms of how you were all getting on? Cause obviously it's quite daunting being so far from home and being in a culture which is completely different to be what you're used to in France. So did you all kind of think or...

ceasoring, which was unusual and talk about the jab that's kind of shared experience throughout your time together. A couple of international people, yes. And sometimes it was kind of funny also to see how people had expectations. Yeah, it feels like a lot of people had expectations. We would have a bigger culture shock than we had, which I found it kind of interesting of people being like, it's about the culture shock and everything. And it's kind of like...

Well, yeah, very some to a degree, but it's not as huge as many people expected, at least in my experience and other international students that I talked with. So that was kind of interesting. And again, I think that at least from the university aspect is that the amount of handholding in American grad schools coming from France.

was astonishing. It was great, but it also was just like that made it, it was almost like, okay, when is the cover shoe gonna drop? Kind of deal. And again, I was lucky that I had a close friend who lived there and who had been there. She was American. She had been there for a while. So that also helped with that. I think one of the biggest culture shock, which I knew going in there, but it's that you cannot walk anywhere. And I know it.

probably make sense of what I was just saying about enjoying being able to walk in London. It's just the crappy public transportation and the inability to walk anywhere. I mean, I had to walk a lot on my campus, which was good, but it's also like, and also the wall, it's the US, so we're doing it better again. My mentality can kind of be hilarious at times. It's just like a...

Or when people call buildings old in the States that still cracks me up to this day and it's like, sweet summer child. Yeah, yeah, it's interesting. It's all relative, I suppose. It's old for them. I know old for us in terms of human life, which is fair. But yeah, it's interesting to think about the depth of history, which...

which the continents do have differently. But I wondered, was the architecture in Texas, was it mirrored from some part of Europe? Because it depends a lot, a lot of the US, especially universities, for instance, do have a lot of inspiration from other parts of the world in terms of what they choose to do. Did you notice that when you were there? Was it, did it stand out at all? Not really. And what is kind of funny is that that university was at a lot of iteration.

original building from the fifties and all. You had some like brand new fees when you had some architects trying to be inventive where I was just like, why are you doing that? My dad is a construction engineer and worked in architecture and everything. So I also, I'm cheating on that way, there are some stuff where I was just like, it's all supposed to be designed, but where's the practical aspect? Like you can do practical in 3D at the same time. So it was really like the lack of practicality. Sometimes I was just like, why are we doing that? But,

I think for me, seeing not so much of the universities, but it's when I moved to Virginia, but I saw much more. I mean, Virginia could, was on the older side as well, but, like there were much more like European inspiration on some of the how older houses and all that I've seen in Virginia compared to Texas. And it's a good point. So one thing that kind of comes out when you think of America is, the university life and, and kind of adult life is completely different. especially if you're in

university town or city where there's a lot of students on campus, you can be quite sheltered. Did you experience that when you were in the year and left to go live in Virginia? You was a lot more exposed to the real America as opposed to just post -grad life in America. No, it was already kind of the same in Dallas because I never lived on campus. I even lived with a roommate the first year or in my own apartment. So, and I was already, I only

was on campus when I had actual classes or I was being a teaching assistant. So I did also a lot of work in my own place or not. So it was kind of like the real life Texas already. So that was kind of the same in Virginia because the thing is that even though the campus was in Dallas, it was downtown Dallas. I mean, Richardson, technically, which is just off of Dallas. So it was not a university town at all. It was just Mack into what Dallas is. So that's also an experience that

I did not have, I think that's something that I had across all of my experiences, whether in France, in the UK or in the US was that I never had this kind of sheltered campus or university town aspect, which I personally kind of prefer because regardless of your age, when you go in, I think it's kind of good to still being sufficient contact with the rest of the world. I completely echo that. When I was choosing my university, I did this little thing of I didn't want to get to a campus university because

One, I was always told that the suicide rates are really high, which is really depressing when you're 16, 17 trying to choose university. Why are you telling me this? But also it's the lack of mixing is that you only have students. So I studied, there was four universities in the same city. So there was lots of different people and playing sport. You could mingle. It was relatively close to my parents house. So I could get by Washington and things like that, which is quite nice.

as they're going to satisfy benefit. But yeah, it is interesting. It's important side benefit. But it's quite like in -state out -state in the US when you get the different costs, right? I think that's one thing that a lot of Americans don't go too far because you get a much better discount if you stay in the same state. So why wouldn't you kind of go close to home for that reason as well then?

Yeah, because compared to like, I know when I went to the UK at that time, it was like, you know, it's slash, it was the cause for UK slash EU at that time or anybody outside of that. And like in Texas, it was either you were in Texas or you were from outside of Texas, whether you were from like Oklahoma or China. Like, what? Like it kind of makes no sense at me from me from a European perspective of being like, why would you do such, basically lumping any other state still in the same country?

with any other continent and then just privilege like, but I'm not in any decision now with any decision or power whatsoever. I was just very confused. Yeah. It's confusing. so then, another thing you kind of went through with your life in America was, was you got, citizenship or you got a, your residency. Yeah. What was that process like? You kind of alluded to it in the first step, first part of the podcast.

been quite a difficult process. Yeah, like I said, the PhD was less complicated and the PhD was simple, including all the stuff. What happened is that I got married after finishing my third year at university. Literally, my then -fiance came, flew there to pick me up the day I turned in all my grades after I had my dissertation proposal approved like two weeks before. And then we drove across half of the country and

got married like three, four days after arriving. I used to joke with him being like, you're going to have to nod to me to say I do because I'm tired. I love you. I'm tired. Yeah. Just drinking some rap though down the aisle. A lot of, a lot of very great tea, a lot of our great tea for a change. But, that's, you know, the

demigration process, I was technically an easy case because I was filing for an adjustment of statutes from my student visa to permanent residency. But then when you go into the permanent residency through marriage, which was my case, there are two levels. There is the first conditional one. And then two years later, you need to apply to the removal of condition and a year later, you can also apply for citizenship, but you cannot.

have your citizenship approved until they accept the removal of conditions, which can take longer. So I basically initiated, we initiated a process for my first green card for managed residency in the summer of 2019. And I admit that I got extremely lucky in how quickly things went. I still got my citizenship September last year, so four years later. And that's actually being extremely lucky.

Wow, that's a lonely bit of PhD. Yeah, I was enrolled for four years of PhD, even though it took me a bit longer. And the amount of paperwork that goes with it is more paperwork than to apply to a PhD. Well, you passed that, which is another test you've done in your life. I am done.

And then, so I'm assuming you're now working in the US. How's that been in terms of working life from Europe to the US? Is there other big differences you've seen? Yes. First of all, what is time off? I mean, in France we take time off all the time. I mean, in certain cases.

Because my dad was at his own business. He was a consultant in, I mentioned construction engineering and he had very long hours working for himself, but he was still able to take more time off. The mentality here of like, you can take time off maybe once every eight months or, you know, no. It's like the corporate hamster wheel or the mentality here is really like, wow.

What the heck, coming from France where I can be the first to say in France, maybe we're pushing things the opposite way, but it's kind of like, middle ground when you can breathe and not work yourself to death all the time. So after my PhD, I did work a couple of years in corporate as a content manager in a domestic and an international company. And I...

ended leaving a job because it was really a toxic environment and not the right fit about a year ago. And then I decided to actually do start my own business, which admittedly I found much easier to do that in the States than in France because I had considered that at some point in France and the bureaucratic headache had me go like, no, I'm still going to stick with normal employment. And so I've had a lot of...

some soul searching and I started with more video consultancy and I actually shifted recently because my background being in film and media studies and my corporate experience, you know, in content management, the video part made sense. And I had started on the side to do intuitive reading and tarot professionally. I've done tarot for over 23 years. I started doing that professionally last year.

And I'm actually as of last month, I am transitioning into a full -time what I call intuitive guidance and tarot reading because it's been much more fun for me. And this is where I don't have to be begging clients to work with me. That's such an interesting shift to go into as well. That's so cool. Well, then you for finding a passion and making it a career, which is really cool. Have you found that the

the US culture is more open to that? Or I guess the US is so broad that you'll find everyone and you can find a good market or a good niche for for for Tarot and things. Yeah, pretty much. I think it's really like I think there's more openness to it now because I think for this type of thing, there's been, you know, what we may call spiritual entrepreneurship, there's a lot of stigma around it, but there's a lot more and more people open to it. And

And also working remotely opens you to the whole world. I mean, I had people, I had a lot of clients primarily in the US. I also had somebody from Scotland working with me. So this is, and I had somebody else in the UK, I don't remember where she was, but it's kind of like, that's the beauty of, you know, working remotely is that it really opens up things. And even in the US I've had people who never had a tower reading, but they were like...

Well, I like your NRG. I like working with you. All this is really cool. And sometimes people, I just talk with them, meeting them. Even before I made that complete shift when it was just a side fever. your tower as well. Where can I book a reading? And I'm like, okay, I'm following the NRG and the money. And I'm loving this work. Was that your tower reading? there's money here.

That's been really interesting because I always thought that like the video side of my business would be the heavy lifester while this part would just, you know, be something I loved we. But, and since I started it, it was funny cause you talk about, you know, finding your niche in anything. I offered it, you know, just to test the water in October last year because I was like, spooky season, Halloween. People are giving themselves permission to explore that because there's technically the spooky season. That's my excuse. And then I had a lot of people just.

really great feedback. And then I was like, okay. And I kept pulling the thread, having fun, really seeing, feeling like I made a better difference in people's lives. So it was kind of like, okay, we're doing that full time. No, that's great. That's just incredible. And that's very good. Good point. So get the leverage when it's already acceptable to do something different and try something new, which you're offering. So yeah, it's very, I guess you have a PhD in it, so you should know.

And it's also the fun thing is that it's not like, because I think there's often this idea in pivot and which can even apply, you know, if you're a living expert and you're like, maybe I want to go back to my home country or maybe I want to explore another country where it's kind of like, this thing didn't pan out the way I was expecting, but it's always a life lesson. It's always, you know, we've never wasted any time. So even now, even in that work, like all my background in storytelling and, you know, even on mythology or so, it's still stuff because

reading symbols, I'm really good at that, you know, and how to communicate with people. And even, you know, as a former content strategist, I still understand how to build my business as well and find the right messaging to talk and interact with people. So it's like all of that are still building blocks. Even if when I did start a PhD, I was not planning that I would be a full -time job reader. Has, go back to your kind of,

your life in America then. So in terms of socially, did you have extracurricular activities which you did to make friends? Did you do tarot when you were at university or was it something you got into later on and you had a different hobby to socialize with people? So I didn't would say use that as a to socialize, but I've been doing tarot for 23 years. So I had been doing that in high school. So that's been a hot minute now.

But one thing I was lucky in the States is that I didn't mention, you know, when I was in London meeting a few people from that Star Wars online community that I was still part of it. That's how I'd met my really good friend who was in Dallas and who helped me really settle in. And I had a lot of friends in the US, not necessarily in Texas, but in other parts. So I got to visit them and also even just sometimes chatting, you know, video chatting when you're not like 10 hours of difference or God knows what, it's easier when the worst is, you know,

hours of difference. So, and, and funny enough, a few of them are also into tarot and sometimes even to this day, we still meet up a few times a year to just do tarot nights. So yeah. And did you, did that help you then when you first moved in terms of getting over the distance, knowing that you had this community to, to lean on if you needed someone to talk to or some help or some advice in terms of, you know, which, which Lord of the Italian should I buy or?

Is this good thing to read? What's a pop star? That kind of stuff. Did you try to lean on them for day to day support? I did lean on my one friend in Texas and then was in Dallas. I mean, I stayed with her also. She was very generous in how I stayed with her just the time that I needed to find a roommate and everything. And then there's always like that. There was another group of people I've kind of had were friends and then there was a fly out and anything due to...

Different values, I will leave it at that, but it was really helpful because as much as I was lucky that I had a lot of my friends there and then I started dating my now husband toward the end of my first year in Dallas. So it was also a lot of support even when we were long distance for a couple of years.

And I was also very lucky that the person who was really amazing, maybe not on the day to day, but was still really helpful was my committee chair. She was absolutely amazing. I was extremely lucky to work with her during the whole time. She really made a difference. And overall, I would say my department, like the people in my department were really, really great. And our graduate advisor, which was the first one I had met, like when people were saying, go talk to the graduate advisor.

She was also an expat because she was from Sweden and she had come to UTD. She was older, but she had come to UTD where I did my PhD to do her own PhD. So it was also that there was kind of like this understanding and this, hey, I went through that X, Y, Z. So it was like, I would say mostly from people I knew even though I had met other people that I had met other people while in Dallas. But I would say during my time in Dallas was mostly people I had known from that online community or.

people in my department who were really, really helpful. Great. And then, so obviously you met your husband, was that at a social event? How did you meet? That was online community. We had known of each other's existence for like eight or nine years, but we had never actually talked to each other until I moved to the States. And we had a lot of mutual friends in common, including some of mutual friends that I had known for 10 years, who I'd known for close to 20 years. So

It's funny when they tell you, the internet, it doesn't last. That community started like 20 or closer to 25 years ago now. So that's, so it depends. It's like what you put in it, you know, it's like, what do you invest in it? And so that's how I met him. So was he also living in Dallas at the same time? No, he was in Virginia, in Richmond, where we live now. He was raised in the area, lived there the whole time. So I got to visit him in May,

2017 for the first time. So that seems very weird to me. And how did you find that long distance thing? Obviously you'd been long distance friends for a while. Did that kind of, was it more difficult? How did you deal with long distance relationships? I know a lot of the listeners might have relationships as well who are different time zones, different countries perhaps. And it's quite difficult speaking from my experience. Yeah. It's the thing I think is that

You have to have something to share. If you have nothing to talk about, then you're not going to go anywhere because it's a... So we did start at France. I mean, I never thought there would be anything beyond that at that time, which is kind of funny looking now, but it's like, you know, you start at France, you talk about a lot of stuff you have in common and everything. And we were able to see each other like a few times a year, but I think having, you know, stuff in common and things to talk about.

was, and also having your own life. I mean, you know, he has a job, he had his friends, I was doing my PhD and everything. So it's like, you also learn to give each other space in that because, you know, you're, you're not living in the same place. So you want to also, you know, be cool with that and really having a lot to share and talk, you know, including when you realize that you're going to be serious, you know, have all the big talks, whatever that exactly may be for you, but it's like, okay, you

We're having it. The only thing we can do right now is talk. So we can as well, you know. And then your family back home. What was that like in terms of how often did you go out to see them? Did your parents come out to visit you or friends from France? What was your kind of cadence with communicating with them? So basically I left about zero friends between friends. So like I was saying, most of my friends were in the US. So that was that. But for my parents, I'm an only child.

For my parents, I was kind of rougher because it's like, I know because it's a bit hard to be able to visit. I mean, they, if I visit, I was always the one visiting because it was easier. But it's like when I was able to go there, you know, before the pandemic, once during the pandemic. But like the pandemic really did not help as well because that was a, that was a wall over thing. I still remember when I went in 2021.

I was almost turned down. Like it was 7 a in Paris. I was almost turned away and sent back because somebody couldn't read that, kept misreading my COVID test and they're like, you had the COVID test done at X time, so it cannot be valid. You were like three hours late. We don't know if you got COVID or whatever. And like, dude, it's 7 a I couldn't have it done later than that because of the freaking plane. Like, chill.

I was like, I was a man. I know, it's weird, because if a flight gets delayed or something, then you could... Which was my case as well, that the flight got delayed like... Do not recommend Paris -Charles de Gaulle airport to anybody, by the way, this is still the first airport I've ever been to. I am sorry for anybody for whom it's the first taste of France. On behalf of all of France, I apologize, but yeah, this is a headache even when you speak French. It's funny, because I flow into Lyon and I...

Most of the time things are France, either by ferry or by train because the Eurostar is so, I love the Eurostar, it's such a great way of getting around. It's yeah, it's, and it's similar price to a flight. Right. And usually people at the train stations are more nice and competent. So that's also a plus. And you can take more bags with you as well. That's what I like. They may not have many days off for work, but they do have a lot of like nap star holidays. But how's that been like? What's the culture been like for 4th of July, Thanksgiving?

Labor Day, have you really threw yourself into it? Now you've got your husband's family and things or is it still quite new to you? I still miss many of the days. I mean, now I have Labor Day, Memorial Day and the 4th of July and Thanksgiving down in my brain, but any other like the isolated Mondays off, I'm always usually my husband is going to tell me, yeah, I have next Monday off or something. I'm like, what? He's been a few years and I still do not remember that.

Also, Memorial Day is kind of nice because we did get married the Sunday of Memorial Day weekend, so it's also like an excuse for us to, you know, anniversary celebration or whatever. And even though the history of Thanksgiving is very problematic in term of, in term of history, I do appreciate kind of starting the holiday season earlier than in Europe when we technically, you know, it's more like in first half mid December. So

I do appreciate, you know, despite the problem with the meaning of Thanksgiving and its history that to get started late November, you know, all the way to early January. So it's kind of nice to have that excuse. And I totally became American in the way that I do set up my Christmas decorations the weekend after Thanksgiving now in late November. And I am not ashamed to say that.

It lasts longer, right? It's more sustainable. Exactly. And I'm a December baby, so I like that. Yeah, I'm August, so I'm the opposite end. I like being on all days. Wonderful. Is there anything else you wish to share from your experience abroad in terms of the day -to -day life, the socializing? We've talked quite a lot, which is great. There's one thing that comes to mind, which

may seem weird and that I was not expecting in a good way is that I'm a vegetarian and growing up being a vegetarian in France was pain in the rear. To put it very mildly because it was like so you eat fish or you eat chicken or you or you're a vegan and like having spent over 30 years of my life in France trying to have to explain over and over again what being vegetarian was it's really way easier in the US to be vegetarian.

And I absolutely love that, including like sometimes like, because I don't care what is anybody else plate. Like I had people like, does it bother you? I'm like, I don't care. It's not my plate. Enjoy. And I had some of, ironically, my friends at some point wanting to go to a ribs restaurant and we're like, we don't know. I'm like, we would probably have a salad. Irony. That was one of the best salads I ever had. Everybody was dripping eating, you know, in sauce and eating meat.

and I was enjoying one of the best salads ever and I was just like I'm here for that. But yeah, I'm sort of Disney -y love me either and and I went to a wings place and yeah, I'd eat wings and I'd qualify wings and they're incredible. They're one of the best things ever and it's like this like meat heaven and I know my cauliflower like this tastes so good. Which is yeah, I think that's one of the best things since since the pandemic as well veganism has exploded more in the UK and there's a lot more options now available and I think

some parts of the world are getting catching up perhaps. But yeah, you think that 10 years ago it wasn't that much of a, it was very much an outside thing to do. Where now I think there's a lot more options for food, which you know, it's wonderful. Then I think food in the US gets quite a bad rap. I think especially in Europe. Sorry, English food gets a bad rap.

They put sugar in everything, which I mean, I hate, but that also gives me an excuse if I want to bake something, you know, or eat sweets or baking goods, I'm going to make them myself at home. But overall, I mean, you can make things work. It's like once you know what to look for, like, you know, that things are going to be way too sugary. Well, there's way to find and not necessarily super expensive ones to find, you know, or do more things from scratch or, you know, just eat more and more simply. But

Yeah, going out, it's way easier. And that was even when I visited for the very first time in 2012 to find vegetarian options when you go out, which has been really, really nice. So that's something I do appreciate and that I was not expecting coming from Europe. Sure, there are issues with how people eat here in the U .S., but there's also good options and good surprises that do happen, including if you're a vegetarian or I guess even a vegan.

Much better hosts for the culminating is the way I was thinking for the more accommodating for different dietary requirements, so to speak. I'm sure gluten gluten free be another one. Like going to Germany, try have no gluten is very difficult or sanglutane in France. It's like, yeah, good luck. Stubbanoisery is pure gluten. So if you asked you just to kind of share about your time. Can we go into section three?

So hello, welcome back to the podcast. We're going to start with three. What about a review of your time? So Natasha, this is kind of where I asked my guests initially, if they could go back to before they moved abroad, what might they tell themselves or might they change just to help the experience that they've had be better or different or richer? So both times in my case, I move for my studies. So it's also something that is kind of like, you know,

giving a certain color, so to speak, to my experience. But I would say if you're going to engage in study in both cases for me, I was really, I did a lot of research on the program themselves. So I really knew what it was. Even when I went on a win, so to speak, you know, to UTD, I was very familiar with the department already.

So that was something where I had, you know, a leg up because I was very familiar with what they did and the program because I was, I had collaborated with several students and professors there. So I would say if you're going to go and be like, I'm going to invest my time and my energy into a program. And that's why you're moving abroad. Make sure that you're not just picking any program, but really make sure it's something you're interested in. Will there be classes you hate? Yes, that's part of the deal. No matter if that's your like five -week -a -time -home.

On the other side of the world, there will be classes you hate. But besides those exceptions, really making sure you pick something that not only the program interests you, making sure the university share your values. That's also extremely important because for me UT Dallas was not only like a big international, you know, I had a big number of international students that were really inclusive. We were the only self -campus in the States that

was in the top 25 of LGBTQ plus friendly campuses in the US. We were the only one in the South who rank sufficiently well enough. And so that's great for your university, but really sad for the rest of the certain states, I suppose. But yeah.

So this was one of the values that was important for me. So it's like it's the program, but also the values, I would say. And to a degree, I think this also does apply if you're moving, like, let's say for a job, which was again, not my experience, but I would say make sure that at least on paper, you know, it looks like it's sticking enough boxes. Maybe you don't care about many of those boxes, but I would say if on the outside, at least, you know, because once you're inside, you know, you can have some whiplash and stuff. I am not denying that. I've been there.

even in my career, but try to ask as many questions to make sure that the values of the company also aligns with yours and to get a good idea because there will always be, even if you have support, and also I was lucky to have support, like, even if I was in the UK with not much support, but I was close enough to home that if an emergency had happened or anything, my family could support me, or I have at least one really good friend in Dallas who...

would be able and people elsewhere in the country, even if it's a big one. If that can give you peace of mind, even if I would say it's also totally normal to feel homesick or feel that, you know, kind of disconnected. So it's like not so much the, my gosh, am I failing or it's, you know, not this is what I mean. It's the end of the world. Am I a failure as an expat if I suddenly feel homesick?

It's also recognizing it's part of the process and have people you can talk with, whether they're local where you are, or, you know, if it's people you want to chat with at home or other friends or even, I mean, that wasn't my case, but I know people who needed to see a therapist for maybe just a couple months or something because they were adjusting and you're taking care of yourself. So if you need that, explore the opportunities you have. There are even usually some low cost options or anything.

Is that making sure you take care of yourself and if you suddenly get home seeking you not being a failure, you're being completely. Yeah. It's very bright. The people will very, you know, courageous that the people who did go and seek therapy to get over it, because there's something which we don't do enough of probably is it acknowledged that there is professional help you can get to, to help work through it. if you, you are in a situation rather than just sit for inside it. So yeah, it's definitely something that you'd encourage them to do if they do.

We can't find another option or can't find it and do speak to a professional because they are professionals for a reason. So yeah, definitely worth it. If you are struggling to reach out or get professional help because you might realize that everyone does go through it. As we usually were saying, I found it really tough, especially in Sweden when it was dark and cold and that was far from everyone. That was the very low point, which is the birth of the podcast. So that's quite...

I threw myself into this and threw myself into this stuff, which is with my kind of way of getting out of it. But also I have a girlfriend who's got a degree in psychology, so she helped quite a lot as well. so now I see why you're with her. I'm just teasing. I'm just teasing. But I also love that you mentioned the podcast because sometimes it's also remembering because we can get into the tunnel vision of like, I want to experience all the things, you know, all the new fees and socialize and everything and also do whatever it's, you know, for work or studies or anything.

But sometimes just going back to something on your own that you love doing. You know, for you, you decided to start a podcast even if obviously, you know, you brought other people on. But there's always, you know, that time when you need to brainstorm and do stuff even on your own. But have this kind of hobby or creative outlet, even if it turns into something else at some point, it's still what does bring you joy, you know? And maybe you want to just go for walks more often. Maybe you just want to read more, you know, even if it's carving one hour or even 40 minutes here and there and...

that can also give you build more familiarity into and balance out all the new experiences because even if you're super excited about new experiences, kind of creating like familiarity can also help you balance out and be able to feel better. Completely. Yeah. It's I think having a balance, as you mentioned, yeah. Do go be brave, do go explore, but also have a safe space, which is either you're, you know, being creative by yourself, as you said.

Just maybe for you, speaking with the online community, which is all kind of your nucleus perhaps, which is the kind of the constant which you've always had and you know, or you've got a favorite TV show from how you listen to or watch or you've got some music you'd like where you've got an artist you keep up to date with the music and things like that or a great YouTube channel or something which I spent a lot of time watching YouTube. A lot of time watching the UK political system kind of fail.

Which was quite interesting to watch from afar. I've watched some stuff going down in France, too. So yeah Interesting did you have much? Kind of reverse culture shock. So when you kind of look back at France now with a lens of you've lived somewhere else either the UK or or America do you go and see I see that doesn't you I thought that was really good at home or for those really bad actually see opposite every kind of got that empathy for your country

That depends for what. There are some places where I'm just like, you could really do better. And at the same time for me, one of the biggest experiences or it's kind of stuff we can take for granted in our home countries because we've been in them for like 20, 30 years and they were like, crap, I really took that for granted and I thought it was the same everywhere and it's not.

And one of the things for me was, and again, there was issues in France as well, just like everywhere else, but like the lack of puritanism in France was really great. Even I spent eight years of my life in Catholics, middle and high school. We were a bunch of hippies by evangelical standards. And it's like some of the stuff that

Like the ease of relationship between different genders in France and again there's a lot of sexism and other issues in France but overall it didn't feel like this separation of genders as well in France and like you could talk to other genders and it was totally fine there was not that like a puritan... crap going on and...

And sometimes, especially with the general in the US, but I especially experienced that in Texas when I was like, well, well, well, can we just chill for a second? We're human beings and in conversation, stop just putting all of those weird stuff on top of that. Please just stop. Yeah. It's funny because we're social beings and social means just like having friends and stuff.

It's funny because a lot of my friends from home are mainly women because they're just over time their relationships have kind of lasted longer. So some of my best friends from when I was four are just being women because we are more outgoing. We like some TV shows and we're just friends, right? So it doesn't, then there's nothing more. Which is good. It's normal. That's just life, right? But they speak to like, I know my friends who have the boys and stuff, which is quite an interesting concept. And I think France...

has always been like pretty good for that. It's always sweetened as well. I've noticed my score is quite good for mixing, but I guess it's also because the quality is much higher though in terms of like if you look at universities and subjects taking the mix of men to women for each subject was a lot more even, albeit there's still a gap, but the gap was a lot closer. So it meant that you had in the workplace, it wasn't just, you know, white malege men, it was a mix of different people from different backgrounds. So you...

became normal to see everyone mixing everywhere. I was to just, you know, in certain situations, which is maybe what, at the initial, at the middle of times, it's just a bit more in the past, as opposed to a more progressive basis. But that's quite a shame. Yeah. And I definitely lean on the progressive side of things. So there's, it's true. That was one of the things that for me, and I think it's changing in the States. And I mean, I see most of my close friends are also, you know, on the

progressive side of things and everything. So they've also experienced that even without being from Europe, that it's true other stuff that I took for granted. And I was just like, like this progress in mixed scenes of backgrounds, genders, ages, you know, whatever. I had a bunch of guy friends even now and it's normal. You know? Of course it's normal. It's friends. Then that's the gender assigned to your friend.

But how have you found the political thing? Because obviously, America is quite well known for its political systems and especially now with the election coming up and stuff. How have you found that as a French person and the French not to draw a broad brush, they're quite, rebellious or revolutionary? Well, yeah, we are. How has it been from...

what you expect the political system to be like in France to what you're experiencing now. I don't have to these days. I don't understand how you can consider having election, which was supposed to be, you know, universal surprise or whatever, but indirect. I'm just like, either you elect your people directly or you're not having the grand electors or whatever in the middle still baffles me. It baffles me before I moved to the States. So it just, it's not done better. It's, I think one thing for me that does

that is profoundly interesting is that often I found, and again, it's very broad generalization here, so there's obviously a lot more nuance to that, but many times I find in the US people want to consider that voting, you have to be completely infused with the candidate, while in France we really have, and I think probably more European, technically speaking, where I think that in France and other places in Europe, we're kind of looking at elections as in, okay,

It's not a taxi, it's not going to take me to my perfect destination. It's freaking public transportation, maybe because we're European. It's going to get me as close as possible to my dream destination. Sometimes you're going to have to walk for miles. Sometimes you're lucky and you only get to walk a couple blocks, but I think having this approach to election where just like, okay, I'm not expecting to be super enthused about the candidate I'm voting for, but I'm trying to get the least bad option.

is something that for me is not as common in the US where I feel like a lot of people, again, very general. So there are obviously a lot of people who don't think like that, but I have witnessed that tendency of being like, my candidate, if I vote as to, you know, be so close to perfection or something, well, you know, me coming from France, okay, what's the holy shitty option? What's the lesser of two evils or three or four?

having multiple parties and choices is quite useful as well, I think, which is anyway, I think one way to end the podcast. Do you want to share more, I mean, you mentioned before about your kind of business in terms of the online work you were involved in and if you want to share what people can find you? sure thing. So yes, I mentioned I consider myself a soul alchemist and an intuitive reader now. So

I do work with a wide range of different people, whether they're seeking me for more life guidance or more business oriented because I've also supported a lot of entrepreneurs. We needed clarity and inspiration through Tarot and other intuitive practice for their current professional season. And you can find me on my website. I am also active on LinkedIn, on Instagram and on YouTube. I'll put links in the show notes for those who are used to working.

I need to send you my updated ones. Yes, please do. Wonderful. And as always, thank you, Natasha, for spending your time with me. I appreciate it. Stay tight with you. But evening for me, I really enjoyed the conversation. It's very interesting. It's very interesting to understand a bit more your experiences of different countries in terms of the kind of either side of the Atlantic and out of the seminar, but also different. And I guess the

The strength of your online community, even though it started so early in the online journey, is really inspiring to see how you can be so far from each other and still have such a great connection to the point where you've got a husband out there, also a friend which got you a PhD. So it's really helped you a lot. It feels that you're the online world. Half of our wedding guests were from bad community. We had a very small wedding. Half of the people were there.

There are two people I consider like a heart brother and a heart sister. The first time I met them in person were three days before getting married. My heart brother from that community walked me down the aisle and my heart sister was my maid of honor. it's so beautiful. Did you ever see him at a wedding or was it traditional? We didn't go to Star Wars, but at the very last minute my heart brother, because he was like, do I play the Imperial March? And I was like, let's do this. And he was just on his phone. Most people didn't hear it, but we got a kick out of it. So.

That's so beautiful. Well, I want to thank you for ending the podcast and as always, you have enjoyed it. You have found something interesting and insightful. Please do let us know in the comments. Please do subscribe to the podcast. Maybe you want to hear more about it and you want to get in touch. Obviously, we're active on all socials. As always, we'll see you next time for the Expat Pod.