James Doran (00:06.222)

So hello and welcome to the Expat Pod. My name is James, your host, and today I'm joined by Molly. And Molly, if you could please share with us where you're from and where you've lived. That'd be great. Sure thing. So I currently live in Costa Rica, but I am originally from Washington, DC. Great. We can go into the podcast.

James Doran (00:29.166)

So we're in one of the podcasts about getting there. So Molly, this is where I kind of ask my guests a bit of the kind of background as to, well, first of all, the why they wanted to live abroad and also the how. So if we start with the why. So what was your kind of inspiration for wanting to move and live in Costa Rica or anywhere in particular? Well, to be honest, it was kind of a combination of things, but just being closer to nature and a little bit more grounded. And I've had a lot of spinal surgeries in my life and I spent a lot of time in

some pain, lot of nerve pain. And when I first came to Costa Rica, noticed that I was in significantly less pain. And so that was also a big motivating factor that, you know, winter's just kept getting harder and harder in DC. and I became less and less mobile and that completely changed, you know, when I moved to Costa Rica. what, is that just because of the temperature and the climate, which changed or was it the food and the way of life you were having? You know, I think it's like a 12 part answer. I think it's like.

eating more whole foods, having less stress in my life, breathing cleaner air, spending more time outside, getting more vitamin D, being barefoot more often, just getting, you know, not being so influenced by alarm clocks and light fixtures and more influenced by, you know, the circadian rhythm and being so close to the equator. I don't know what's changed the pain levels. I don't know if the like barometric

pressures? I don't know. I don't know the answer to that. just know my body doesn't like the cold and it's never really that cold here, you know. That's amazing. It's great to hear that that's a bit of positive change in your life, which is always a nice thing to have when you live abroad. So why did you think of going to Costa Rica? it for traveling through, were you traveling for South America or were you just for a dark map and go there? What was the kind of reason for Costa Rica?

You know, people ask me that all the time and I was trying to think of the answer why and I realized that it's really kind of embedded in my whole childhood in a way. Like we had a exchange student when I was in eighth grade and she was from Costa Rica. My best friend in high school is from Costa Rica. So I think it was just sort of always there. And then when I came and visited, it was in March of 2016 and I was just in

James Doran (02:53.111)

so much pain in DC because it was the end of the winter and I came to Costa Rica and there was such a huge difference. And so that was what really kind of kicked it off. where the, you I don't know. think it was just always there. always, you know, what I knew of Costa Ricans, both beautiful humans and just really, you know, beautiful countries, beautiful people. And I just wanted to learn more. wow. That's always kind of been a stable part of your life then with your friends and

And exchange students, it was quite a, quite an early fixture in your childhood, which might've embedded itself in your subconscious perhaps. When you, when you then moved in, when was that in terms of how long ago did you move to Costa Rica? In January of 2021. like 10 months into the pandemic or whatever. Yeah. So did that make a huge difference in terms of being able to move? Were you looking to move before the pandemic and then you got delayed or?

Not at all. You know, I had a very brick and mortar business in Washington, D .C. I own a podcast production agency and we had a recording studio in downtown D .C. in a beautiful castle mansion and business was really picking up and gaining momentum. And then the pandemic happened and, you know, the city was shut down. The mayor, you know, ordered everybody to stay home. And all of a sudden, you know, my my very physical, you know, business

had to adjust, right? And so I quickly closed the lease. I had a lease on a house and a lease on a commercial space and I had multiple Airbnbs. So in April of 2020, closed all of the leases on all of the properties, took a hit on some of the stuff, but just stopped the bleed before it got worse. And everybody thought I was closing my business, but I was like, no, I'm closing the liabilities because

The Airbnb money dried up. I'm not gonna ask my clients to defy the mayor. like, it's March 2020, we're all wearing spacesuits to Costco and stuff. It was, I mean, we were afraid to touch our doorknobs. It was a crazy time. I was not trying to force my clients to come in. Nobody was even recording anyway, right? So it was kind of a moot point. So I closed the leases and took a month off and then just realized I'm gonna...

James Doran (05:18.222)

be better at doing everything fully remote than everybody else. And so I revamped in May of 2020 and grew the business 200 % that year by adjusting to the new virtual world because we sell podcasting as a business development tool. So interview the people you want to do business with and then you get SEO and then you get social proof. But really it's about the relationship.

And so a lot of our clients couldn't go to conventions, couldn't go to meetings anymore, networking things. So the podcast became an even more viable tool and being able to do things remotely opened up the world. And so when it was presented and produced the right way, my clients saw a lot of value in that. So we grew and I was pretty untethered, but I was still paying a lot of money to live just outside of Washington, DC. And I was working fully remote.

And Costa Rica had been like a 10 year plan. You know, it was a like, I'm going to grow this business. I'm going to sell it. I'm going to parlay that into a speaking career. And then I can travel and because what I in 2019, it was hard for me to imagine where I could work remotely in Costa Rica and make money. was a like, once I've really hit all my goals and success and I have some money, then I'll go.

But then all of sudden, you know, the whole world changed. And here I was with this opportunity, like January, 2021. Like if I go now and I tell my clients now, hey, we're going to be remote for a while. And instead of being in DC, I'm going to have a Costa Rican background, but everything's going to be fine. And they were like, all right, let's see what happens. And sure enough, everything was fine. So it was not.

super planned in that sense, but I just figured, you know, it's a good time to go now, get my clients used to it. And more importantly, make sure it's something that I want to do because, you know, a lot of people put off happiness and what they want until later. But later isn't promised. And the pandemic really showed us that. And, you know, you've moved around the world, like lots of people move someplace and they romanticize it. And three months later, they're out, you know, it's not.

James Doran (07:38.446)

for everybody and rightfully so. So I really wanted to explore that before I was 70, you know, and couldn't enjoy it anyway. That's a very good point you make and a lot of people do delay the kind of rewarding themselves with things that will bring them joy. And, you know, the beauty about living abroad and a lot of people who can go abroad, you can always go back. So...

why not try and do it when you're younger, when you've got less responsibility or you've got more freedom and you've got actually a chance to go back and pick up what you left in case it wasn't the right decision. But at least you've tried it. Whereas, you if you delay it 10 years, you might go, well, what if I did it then? I love it so much. I could have been here for X number of years beforehand and really made the most out of it. Yeah. And you kind of regret it a bit. So you did the right thing of just...

is riding the wave of the moving to remote working at the right time. I guess the, the, the start of a pan, a pandemic of podcasting, cause during, during the pandemic, everyone got into podcasts a lot more because they had a lot more free times to go walking. And in the UK, I got a lot into podcasts a lot because my one activity a day was going through a very long walk to listen to three or four podcasts in like three hours or four hours, just because it was the thing that could be in nature and do.

And it was kind of saved me a little bit during the pandemic in terms of my sanity. it was a good time to be a podcast producer from your side.

So in terms of then moving to Costa Rica, did you need to get a visa? Did you need to get a accommodation? What was your kind of approach to doing that whilst you were still in the US? Well, know, Costa Rica has a pretty lenient tourist visa program. So when you come into the country, you get a visa for however long you're going to be there, up to 180 days. It used to be 90 days, but they just changed it to six months.

James Doran (09:41.326)

But if you're coming in as a tourist and you're leaving a week later, you get a seven day visa. know, so when you come into the country, if you show a return ticket leaving the country, 179 days later, then you'll get that stamp. So it really just, you know, about what you show them. So in the beginning, I had to do a of the border runs, we call them, because Nicaragua is not that far. It's about two and a half hours drive to the Nicaraguan border from where I live.

And so, you know, that's kind of what you do. You drive up, you park the car, you do all the different, you know, pay this tax, pay that tax, you know, do all this stuff that's not abundantly clear to you. You walk across a border, you go in, you get stamped the Nicaraguan stamp, you walk back out of the building, you walk into the other side, you get stamped again, and you cross back into Costa Rica.

And then you're good for another 90 days. know, so that's kind of the, that's kind of the routine, if you will, you know, so they're pretty lax. do have various residency and, you know, Teresa and, you know, rentista and, know, there's all these different classifications of visas that you can get that they don't make it terribly hard to obtain here in Costa Rica because they recognize that, you know,

immigrants like me, you know, bring a lot of money into the country. And if we're encouraged to stay, then we, know, buy homes or rent and buy the same grocery store every week and go to the pharmacy and, really become a part of the community instead of just kind of moving through. Yeah. It contributes to the economy with money you're earning from outside the country. So it's a positive, some of point of view. Exactly.

Are you still on a tourist visa now or have you kind of changed to a residency visa or what's situation for you? Well, I had worked with an attorney to get that happen, but in classic Costa Rican style, it hasn't happened yet. So I have to start over. But the goal is to have the... So when you... bought a home and when you buy a home, you automatically get the residency visa.

James Doran (12:00.962)

but you still have to apply for it, but you don't have to show all of the income and you know, it's not nearly as a strenuous as a process because you've shown an investment in the country and they're like, that's good enough, you know? And in terms of when you moved the accommodation you had, did you rent an Airbnb or did you kind of find somewhere to live or use a network of friends? How did you do that before you moved? Well, this is when the story gets a little bit more interesting. So when I...

First moved to Costa Rica, I had a business partner, like investor, who was like, I have some people that have a house in Costa Rica in Playa del Coyote, right? And so I was like, okay, great. There was these like, you can stay in the house for free. You just gotta get the wifi set up. I was like, awesome, great. I didn't really understand the layout of, I had been there once, but I, know, I just, whatever. I was just gonna figure it out. So I get there and it's a super remote area. My phone doesn't work.

There's no furniture in the living room. It was just, I wasn't gonna be able to stay there, you know what I mean? And so I lasted three days there and ended up going up to Tamarindo. And I had a friend who was more of a colleague in the music industry in DC. And I had hung out with her once or twice, but we weren't like super close. But her and her fiance were there. And they ended up leaving like a month and a half later. But I went to Tamarindo, got an Airbnb for like two nights.

found a place to rent and then moved in there. So I really only knew one couple, you and they ended up leaving shortly after. But they introduced me to a couple people who ended up introducing me to a lot more. But when I moved into that house, three weeks later, I was drugged and robbed in a home invasion by like three masked professional men, you know, and so it was quite a welcome.

to Costa Rica. Yeah, it was quite the welcome. Well, I'm sure we'll dig a bit deeper into your life in Costa Rica. I'm sorry to hear that happen to you and good to see that you're okay now. must have been, you're still there, so it mustn't have put you off Costa Rica too much, but I'm sure you're a bit more vigilant perhaps, which can't have been a nice experience to have. In terms, did you move by yourself then when you first came or with you with friends or family or? Yeah, I moved by myself.

James Doran (14:25.134)

and my dog. It's been quite exciting. Your dog? Yeah, my little dog. Yeah. That's so cool. How old is your dog? Well, she's no longer with us. She's in the the backyard now, but she lived to be 21. So she had a good run. Yeah, she had a good run. good innings. Was there anything else you kind of needed to do before you moved? Did you kind of have Spanish lessons or did you know Spanish before? I figured I'd work it out when I got here, but I gave everything away.

You know, cause you know, it was in the pandemic, so was trying to sell stuff and Facebook market, but it was just not gonna happen. So I gave pretty much everything away, which felt really good. And a friend of mine took a bunch of my bins of my stuff and I left them at her house. And I packed, you know, exactly, you know, however many bags I could, you know, bring with me. You know, it was like two 70 pound bags, one 50 pound bag or.

something along those lines, you know, and, and yeah, man, just kind of hoped for the best. I think that's a great way of ending the kind of getting there part and we can get into the being there.

James Doran (15:39.374)

So welcome back to the podcast World Position 2, all about being there. So Molly, this is kind of where I understand a bit more about your life in Costa Rica in your case or wherever I guess live. We kind of touched upon it already in the first section about your quite memorable part of the start to living in Costa Rica, which is unfortunate in your sense, but good to see you all, know, fly now and it's good. But in terms of that kind of initial first impression of the country, apart from that

horrible evening you had. What did you think of Costa Rica? Well, you know, it was a very different time in the pandemic. Everything was like kind of shut down. So was very, very quiet. You know, I think it was I knew it wasn't a normal snapshot of Costa Rica, know, so but I was happy to be here. I was excited to be here. was grateful.

Because it was January, was like, know, pandemic happened in March and then we had that crazy summer and then it got cold and I left in January. It had been cold for months. So mean, I was just grateful to be outside getting fresh air and sunshine and I was very happy to be here. Great. then I guess you had that horrible invasion and situation. At that point, did you want to go back or what were you thinking then in terms of you?

have sold everything back home or got rid of it, moved over, this happened in the first week or the first couple of weeks and yeah, did you want to go back or what was your kind of reaction to that? You know, everybody always says that and they always say, I can't believe you didn't want to go back. But like there was nothing to go back to. I had sold my car. I gave everything away. I gave up my lease. It was like

You know, and it wasn't easy to just move around. Borders were being open and closed. I mean, it's not like you could just willy -nilly all over the place. you know, and it, it, that experience changed me to this moment, you know, but, but, you know, I was living in Washington, DC prior to that where, you know, there was gunshots and brutal murders across the street from my house and

James Doran (17:50.498)

You know, I mean people trying to, you know, people literally trying to kill me because I'm riding my bicycle. You know, I mean just unhinged violence and anger and crime all the time. And when that home invasion happened, it wasn't personal. Like I hadn't gone out, I hadn't met anybody, I used the same taxi driver twice. Like when you're from a city that has a lot of crime, you have some street smarts. I didn't just show up talking about Pura Vida, I live in this house over here. Like I was very careful, you know?

And they were just watching in the neighborhood. was a new house. were waiting for somebody to move in. I forgot to close a very small window. And that was the end of that. And so it didn't feel personal to me. And I somehow managed to stay in that house for almost a month, which was probably more of a mistake than staying in Costa Rica, you know? Because I think that did more damage long -term staying in the same environment, you know? But it didn't...

It changed me to my core. I feel like a rescue animal sometimes. Like I got a little like woo in me, you know? But like I'm not fearful of people. I don't look at people differently. Like I'm still very happy to be here. But like if there's a loud noise in the middle of the night, I'm gonna sit up dead awake with my heart racing before my brain can even, you know, catch up with why I'm, you know, reacting that way.

But does it make me feel like I can't trust anybody here or Tico's or it's, you know, there's none of that because, you know, I don't even know who it was. It could have been a Nicaraguan. It could have been Tico's. It could have been a Colombian. It could have been an American. I have, you know, so there was no, there was no judgment there. but it definitely made me very aware that I am in another country, you know, and that

You can't make any assumptions. And, you know, it can be pretty scary when stuff goes down because, you know, we called the cops and they didn't show up and we called again and then they came in with their two foot long guns blazing like the robbery was still happening. Just to further traumatize you. And then they stood in the...

James Doran (20:13.998)

my kitchen with their fingers not on the triggers but like over top of the trigger on these giant guns speaking in very rapid Spanish for like 45 minutes. And I was like literally coming out of being drugged, super confused and not understanding anything. So it's a good reminder as a very privileged American to like.

You know, have some humility, learn the language, respect where you're at. And like the world is not my playground and like I'm a guest here and I have to really like pay attention. It's a very good point about, know, we are guests everywhere I suppose. know, it's interesting to think about that. And I guess if you come from a quite a, a privileged country like America or Europe, you do often go to countries and

a bit of arrogance or naivety probably is a better word for it, thinking it will be what you expect. It probably isn't because people are more desperate maybe or there's just a different balance of equality and you know people are opportunistic as you said you left a door or a window slightly ajar and opportunistic people took advantage of that which you kind of predicted and I you know you learn a lesson from that yourself and will act differently in future and you just yeah.

It's very lucky for it not to be the worst, which is probably the silver lining in that situation. What was it like living or not living, interacting with the police or with the government in Costa Rica? Was that what you expected? it different to the US? Did it last for a few weeks afterwards?

No, it was pretty lackluster to be honest. You know, I went and filed a report at the like Costa Rican FBI, then we never heard anything again. I do know that, you know, they're trying, but you know, it's a, you know, we make a of assumptions as Americans. I'm just gonna speak on behalf of all of us real quick, but, you know, and I see it there, you know.

James Doran (22:16.728)

They'll have meetings with like the US Department of Defense or State Department and they're like, what are you guys going to do about the crime here? And they're like, it's not our country. We're not going to do anything about it. You left America, moved to another country, and you expect us to show up and tell them how to run their government? And they say it in a much more diplomatic way, but it's like, yeah, guys, we are the ones that left. We don't just get all these American protections and benefits and it's...

wild that people are like, you would think all the money they're making off of us. Like, God, it's just like, you know, what about Costa Ricans? They're also living with crime. Like somehow it should change now because we're here and we're spending money. Meanwhile, this has been a problem. Every Costa Rican has a story of being drugged and robbed as well. Like it wasn't, know, like Tico Holmes have barbed wire on them, you know? it's just a really good, like to me,

You know, it's a good reminder on privilege and just to like, like I don't even refer to myself as an expat. Honestly, I refer to myself as an immigrant because I've never heard a single American refer to a Mexican as an expat. You know, and you know, and I know there's some nuance there, but it's like at the end of the day, like I'm an immigrant in this country and I'm super cool with that because that's not a dirty word and I'm super grateful to be here.

You know? No, yeah, completely. I think I agree that it's not dead to earth at all. It's quite interchangeable. It's just another word you can use for same thing. Yeah, it's a wonderful thing about English language. You've got several words for the same thing. But the immigrant podcast didn't sound as good as the expat. So I went for the expat. But it's an interesting point how you prefer to see yourself as that. Because I see it, you're probably right. if you've gone there for a better life, because it's better for your

your physical condition, which is, you know, guess what everyone wants to do when they move countries is it's that reason to get a better life. which is obviously the beauty of living abroad and wherever you're from, wherever you're going. so being in Costa Rica, other than the, the quite difficult starts, once you kind of got settled, what was it like in terms of, you stay in the same area? Did you, did you stay in the same city or did you move around a bit more before you kind of found some other

James Doran (24:33.39)

I moved about 40 minutes away into an apartment building that I felt very safe in and I made friends with like everybody in the building. Most of which I'm still friends with to this day, even though I moved out two years ago. It kind of like Melrose Place. I don't know if you remember that TV show, dating myself with that one. But, and that was great because I felt safe there. And so that like kind of chilled everything out for me. And then I built this little community.

And I lived there for a year and then I came to visit this other part of Costa Rica where I am now and I just fell in love and was like, this is exactly where I want to be. So I live on Lake Arnal now, which is the biggest lake in Costa Rica. It was a smaller lake, but they made it much bigger and built a dam and it supplies like 40 % of Costa Rica's power. And rumor has it there's an alien portal at the bottom of it. So.

You You're going to try and find that one day or go diving? three starts. Maybe you can go down there and try and get a way out. Exactly. then what's it been like socially? You've made friends with people in the building you live with. How was it like socializing and finding people? Was it mainly expats or did you find locals or the travelers? What was the kind of split between those kind of groups? It was, you know, I met a lot of like

Gringos for sure, but then some of my gringo friends have tico friends, you know And my Spanish has gotten much better, but it wasn't that great in the beginning So it's a little harder, know what I mean? If if you know, they don't speak English it makes it super hard But I have found it very easy to make friends here like I have some of the best friendships of my adult life living here like people because

You know, it takes a certain type of person to leave everything and try, you know, so it already kind of puts you in this same category of people and it makes some of those other differences not as much of a chasm. You know what I mean? It's like, and so I have great friendships here, like very intentional friendships of people who are very like -minded and appreciate.

James Doran (26:47.66)

going to hike a waterfall or being outside and going out on the boat and you know doing things like that and I like that my friends now want to do stuff during the day versus like going to some douchey bar in DC and spending a bunch of money and you know like I'd rather meet you at the waterfall at 8am you know I'm good I'm good you know like I'm going to I'm flying back to DC

Thursday and I have a Black Tie event I'm going to on Friday and I have no idea what I'm gonna wear because I don't even have shoes, you know, for that. I got flip flops and tennis shoes. you know, you adjust when you live here to just a whole different thing and you tend to find people that are in that mindset. Is your always very rented outfit when you're in DC perhaps?

I don't know, was gonna go, I'm gonna have to find a Macy's or something, I don't know what's gonna happen, but it's good problem to have. The airport might have something, perhaps? I know, I was like, do they have shoes or duty free? I don't think so. Well, that sounds amazing, and how have you found the kind of nature of what you're living, how are you far away from...

Places to go hiking or go exploring, is it all quite close? Super close. I literally can see the volcano from where I'm sitting right now and the lake. So there's like boats to go on and mountains to climb and waterfalls to... I mean, there's just no shortage of things to do here. So world -class beaches two and a half hours away from here. You know, it's a...

68 degrees year -round. Yeah, there's no heat or air conditioning in my house, which I just think is super cool. Like think about how much, you know, less energy I'm using. I just open the doors and windows. Like that's nice, you know? Like an earth ship, I'd say, definitely. That's really cool. Does it get too warm then in the summer or is it kind of quite similar temperature throughout the year because it's so close to the equator? Well, where I am, I'm in the mountains. I'm 2 ,500 feet above sea level.

James Doran (28:57.838)

on the lake. like even in town, which is 25 minutes away, it's like warmer than it is here. And I get a lot of wind where I'm at. So, but like at the beaches, it could be like 180 degrees. It's not really, but it feels like, you know, your shoes are going to melt on the pavement. Like it's insanely hot, you know? So, and that's only two and a half hours from here. And it's really only like

100 kilometers, 50 miles. I mean, it's super close. It just takes a long time to get there because they're, you know, small one lane roads and, you know, stuff like that. Very windy, you know, but if you really measure distance to distance, it's a very short jump and the temperature difference is like 50 degree. Well, no, probably like 30 degree difference sometimes. 20 degree difference. Yeah. I mean, it's insane.

And do you have a car that I've interviewed, have you found driving in Costa Rica compared to the US best crazy? I mean, there's always a chance you're going to die every time you get in your car because the roads are so narrow and windy and they're just like, you know, not wide enough for an 18 wheeler to make a turn. So, you know, you're just like, you know, but somehow it's still significantly less stressful than sitting in Ubers or riding a bike in DC.

I can imagine it's even it's, you know, the roads, more or less the traffic because of that. And there's probably less beautiful landscapes to be in and enjoying, is kind of both sides of the coin for each place. And then how have you found in terms of being there now, you used to language as improved. How have you achieved that? Did you get lessons? Have you just, you know,

doing a lot of Duolingo? Have you done tutoring or kind of joined language cafes, that kind of thing? Well, a lot of it is like immersion, but I definitely had a Spanish tutor for like twice a week for probably eight weeks or so. And that made a really big difference because, know, Tico speak a very different, that's what they call Costa Ricans, a very different type of Spanish. Just like Mexicans speak a different Spanish, just like people from Spain speak a different Spanish.

James Doran (31:16.302)

It's very nuanced, you know what I mean? So it's like it's important to learn from somebody here. Because like they don't really use us dead here very much the formal it's always too it's like very rarely with that. So there's just all these nuances. So I find that like if somebody will as much as I appreciate wanting to be prepared and all of that like the best thing you can do is move someplace and then just immerse yourself in it and learn from a local because then you can support a local.

support the local economy and learn the local version of that language. My friend from Venezuela came to visit and he was like, I can't understand them. And he speaks Spanish. So just go wherever you're gonna go and figure it out. I think it's the same in some parts of England to be fair. The accent's changed quite a lot. I'm sure in the US it's quite stark. Southern Texas versus.

Yeah, New York City. exactly. And then also, whilst you've been there, how have you found where you're working then? How has that changed your life in terms of the ability to kind of control where you're living and working, whilst still having the same kind of career you've kind of grown before you left? Well, you know, that's a loaded question, right?

I have noticed now after three years that my business has slowed down a little bit because I haven't been going back as much. And so I'm actually planning to spend more time going back. Cause I think in business, you know, you have to be visible. Cause people forget about you out of sight, out of mind. Right. And everybody knows I produce podcasts, right? You want to podcast, talk to Molly. You want to go on podcast, talk to Molly, podcast, Molly, podcast, Molly. But then I left the country.

And people just think I'm over here hanging out with sloths and drinking pina coladas and you know, and it's like, you know, I wish that was true all the time, but it is not. I'm still working and I kind of took my pedal off the, or my foot off the gas a little bit with speaking engagements and stuff. And so business slowed down. So I'm in the process of doing more stuff, going on more podcasts. I'm going back to a big networking event this week, you know, putting a little more effort. And I think it's a good reminder that

James Doran (33:33.568)

You can work from anywhere in the world, you still need to be top of mind with people. So if you're going to work remotely, then you need to do a lot more webinars. You need to do a lot more pocket. You need to just be writing more newsletters, whatever it is, because, you know, people will forget they're like, she's in Costa Rica. Well, listen, I got Starlink. You know what I'm saying? It doesn't matter that I'm in Costa Rica. It has nothing to do with nothing. I'm right in the middle of the United States time zone. I'm right behind.

You know, California and DC, I'm right in the middle. I'm up. You know what I mean? Let's go. Being in Costa Rica shouldn't impact anything. But if you're not staying top of mind with your client base, it's not the remote that's failing you. It's your sales. It's your visibility, you know, depending on your industry, of course, you know what I mean? But for me, that that's relevant. It's getting more and popular on LinkedIn or something just to keep your name out there or whatever. It's quite a skill.

To remind people, know, like I started doing a newsletter pretty consistently again and just talking about like podcast strategies and just typing them out and I'm getting discovery calls from that from people who like, you clearly know what you're talking about. I'm interested in talking strategy. It's like, know, yeah, you know, something as simple as that. But I mean, there was like a solid eight months where I didn't put any newsletters out. So I mean, as far as they knew, I fell off the boat literally, you know?

So then you mentioned about then kind going back and forth from Austin. How often have you been going back to the US beforehand? Or what's been your kind of cadence for seeing friends or family back home? Well, I went back six times the first year and then I went back a few more times the second year and then that's really slowed down. And it's expensive. It's expensive to fly from Costa Rica. Like I was looking at flights to the British Virgin Islands the other day and it actually is cheaper.

and like 10 hours less of travel time to fly back to DC and then to have a completely separate flight to the British Virgin Islands. And it would have been like 600 bucks versus 3000. Like they don't make it easy to leave this place. You know what I mean? And you know, I don't understand airline or any of that stuff, but they definitely make it harder for Ticos to leave this country. You know?

James Doran (35:50.094)

And so I just kind of slowed down because there's a lot of money being spent on airfare You know, I mean I spent like almost 10 grand on airfare in the last three years. That's a that's a lot of bread Yeah, just a lot of that miles you've clocked up there as well. So hopefully you're getting some rewards for that too. lots of free gin and tonics luckily, so I'll take it I'll take it in terms of then like homesickness. So obviously you got home quite a lot the first year and stuff you may

not felt it so much, have you felt that maybe, obviously after your initial start, did you miss certain things, certain people, foods or little things like that, TV shows, they're all the of small things that you're going to have in your life. Like for me, I missed like British biscuits and that was a way, silly things like that, or like BBC news or something. I definitely miss good food and everybody's like, Costa Rica is the best food and people who live here are like, mm.

No, they don't. We have great Whole Foods and like options, but like it's not a culinary place. Most of South America and Central America isn't. Mexico is like the shining star of like food, you know what I mean? But so, and I come from DC. We have like James Beard, a warned winning, you know, lunch counters and stuff. So it's like, I was super spoiled by having amazing food. So I do miss that a little bit, but no, I don't, I don't get homesick at all. I miss people.

And I missed that, but not enough to be like, I want to move back, you know? Not at all. And you know, the thing is, is that the city that I love is not the city. The city that DC is not the city that I love. That city is so far gone. First of all, I'm older. All my friends left that city. That's what happens in cities. You get to a certain age, you leave, you have kids, you never come back. So.

You age yourself out of a city anyway. Then the pandemic happened and I moved into, you know what I mean? There's so many things. So even going back to the city, it wouldn't be the city that I left. So many of those people aren't there anymore. know, so I don't have a home sickness for a place that doesn't exist anymore, you know, and I make a point to spend time with my dad. My mom passed away two years ago. So, you know,

James Doran (38:10.35)

I spent, thank you, I spent time with my dad, but with WhatsApp and video calls and Zoom and I get to see people. We're talking now, right, on video and it's, I'm literally the side of Atlantic Ocean to you. It's cool, you know what I mean? Now it's obviously always better to be in the same room and get a hug and feel that energy and all that, but it's not like if I had moved here 10 years earlier, there wasn't even Wi -Fi yet.

You know, would have been a very different situation. And is your dad, does he live in Washington too or some else in the US? He lives in West Virginia, but it's like an hour and 20 minutes from Washington DC. Like all highway, very close. That were the country roads to go, right? Yeah, exactly. So you think I know West Virginia, is that one song? That was good. That was pretty, I mean, you know, that's pretty good. Thank you. I do make some really bad dad jokes. It's okay.

covered quite a lot, I guess, about your moving abroad. I guess when you left the US, that must have been the January 6th insurrection in DC at the same time, because you moved in January. So it must have been quite an interesting place to leave the US at that time. It can't have been an easy place to have lived, no matter how it made decisions. Truly, it was horrible to just walk like, you know, they talk about like drain the swamp and they show all this.

police and riot gear and all this stuff. The thing about DC is it's so small. It's six miles from one end to the other. Now, it could go a little further north and south and it's hilly here, but everything that you've ever seen about Washington DC is in that center swath. So all the places you guys were seeing on the news were places that I used to ride my bike around with my friends on Monday night. This is not...

You know, people talk about drain the swamp, like, first of all, it's not a swamp. Not literally or figuratively, okay? And it's not, that's a misnomer. And all those politicians don't live there. They don't live there. You know lives there? People trying to survive a city that's constantly getting gentrified, constantly getting out -priced, constantly just being pummeled by new administration after new administration.

James Doran (40:33.966)

I mean, it's sickening, you know what I mean? So many black people being displaced, families being displaced, and they're like, drain the swamp, the swamp. It's like enough already, you know what I mean? And it's like, just to see the insurrection unfolding. I mean, we have 26 separate police forces in Washington, D .C. 26 separate police forces, FBI, CIA, DEA.

Park police, museum police, special police, peace police, I mean I don't even know all 26 of them. Do you know how many of them had to ignore what was going on for that to happen? It was mind -boggling. To me it felt like the end of everything. Yeah, it was quite sobering to watch I think at the time. I've seen quite a few videos. I think it was the guy, the finger on the pulse or something by some comedian who used to be on

Trevor Noah's show was, was there live. watched a lot of videos about that and it was quite an interesting thing to experience. Yeah. And you talk about like other countries and England's not much better, but we were out without guns, suppose, but that's about it. And, we still have a lot of people chanting in streets and stuff, but it's quite, quite difficult. It was wild. And then look what happened afterwards. You know what I mean? The George Floyd summer. mean, it really is just.

It really, to me, it kind of signifies the end of America in a lot. mean, you know, it's this lack of accountability. Like for me, it started with Trump, but it's like, I was raised to think that if you storm the Capitol and kill a police officer, that there would be repercussions for that. Like I was raised to believe that you don't just like break windows and break into a place because you don't like the policy. You educate yourself. You run for those positions.

you advocate for, you know what I mean? Or get on the ballot yourself. So to see all of this just really unfolding, I don't think I'll ever be the same, honestly. Have you had much experience of the politics in Costa Rica in terms of what you've experienced life out there in terms of how different it is to the US? Or what's the whole makeup of it like?

James Doran (42:57.838)

There's no real politics here to be honest. It's very, very chill. However, there's a lot of gringos here with extreme political, you know, opinions, which I about America and Canada, which can be tiring because you're like, Hey guys, you're not there anymore. You know, yeah, it's a good point. Yeah, enough. You know what I mean? People have lived here for 12 years and they're still posting about sleepy Joe and the hoe. I'm like, you've been

in Costa Rica for 12 years, how could you possibly be this invested in being this angry and this ignorant from afar, right? So it is really interesting that.

socialist country has attracted so many Trumpers. I mean, it's really wild to me, you know what I'm saying? It's like, guys really need to read more, you know, and, you know, for people who have such problems with immigrants and wants to build walls, and then they come down here and they don't take their visa requirements seriously and they go late and they say,

I'll just pay this guy and I'll take care of it. And I'm like, you're the same people who want to build the wall, but you don't see this issue with coming down here and skirting him. You're an illegal immigrant right now. You want to piss off an old white guy in Costa Rica, him that. But then the flip side - need to hear it, right? People need to hear that and have that empathy. Cause that's one thing I learned about living abroad is you gain empathy from other people's views and

I understood a lot more what it's like to learn a second language and try and speak it and how hard it is and how brave people are. If you hear someone with an accent it means they're brave. They've come and they've learned something new and they're trying. You can't speak with their language so don't have a go at them for not speaking yours. And you know it's incredible to see all these incredible people who've you risked everything and come and left all their family or left so many things at home to take a risk to better themselves or grow or whatever.

James Doran (45:01.982)

and you get this kind of reverse culture shock looking back at your own country and going, actually that's not perfect, you know, we could do X, Y and Z better because I've got this experience and you talk to people and that's the beauty of traveling and why I love doing this podcast is that I get these viewpoints from people who've lived anywhere in the world. Like I've not been to Costa Rica so I don't know what it's like but from speaking to yourself about it I don't get a view of Costa Rican life and what it is to be in that situation which is wonderful for me because

I learn something every time and that's just, yeah, it's a lot of podcasting now. It's such a great thing to do. Yeah. Thank you for sharing your stories in that situation. Yeah, absolutely. You know, one for all those people. There's also people here that are like grateful to be here, excited to contribute to the community, try to speak Spanish, you know? so it's, you know, it's a nice balance. just kind of got to...

find your way. But in regards to Tico's and their politics, it's really interesting actually. The political parties are like red and blue and you don't see like political signs in people's yards with like somebody's face on them. What they do is each party has a flag maybe to a green, white and green stripe and the other one is half red half blue.

and they're these little flags and people put them up in front of their house on a pole. It's this little letter sized flag and they just put it up in front of their house. So when you're driving down the street, you can kind of see, green, red, green, red, red, red, green, green, you know? And that's it. There's not these like big obnoxious symbols and then they come down after the voting period. So it's short lived. So it's really interesting to see. Yeah, it's a good, we have to do something in the UK where we have

two main parties but loads of fringe parties which still quite still get some seats in in parliament which i guess is your senate or house of representatives or whatever so it's still people people do put the pickets on the in the driveway or in the front yards but not many do it's like the like 10 percent of the population have that on because it's quite a personal thing with who you vote for

James Doran (47:22.23)

It starts something people really talk about. It's like you voted well done. That's all that matters. You've used your democratic right to do that. I don't really care who you voted for as long as you read the manifestos, made an educated decision and that was it. That's how it should be really. I think we've exhausted this topic, which is good. Do you want to go to the third section all about your review of your time?

James Doran (47:50.072)

Hello and welcome back to the podcast, welcome to section three, which is a kind of review of your time. So Molly, this is where I kind of get my guests to maybe kind of think back to when they first moved and if they could offer themselves some advice or change anything if they would do or what bit of advice they might give themselves to enhance the experience they've had or just, you know, prevent them from happening. So if you could think about when you first moved, is there something you tell yourself or something you'd like to do differently?

I don't really have any regrets, but I would just say like take take it easy like a lot of people move here and they want to like Find a place before they get here or they're building a house and they want the house to be done and the cable to be installed before they get here and It just doesn't work that way. I think if you're move someplace, it's good to rent someplace. It's not a single house Don't put yourself out in the middle of nowhere. Put yourself in an apartment building

rent for a couple months and look around. Cause I think as Americans we have a habit like the Amazon culture of like, I'm moving on Thursday. So on Saturday morning, an Amazon delivery is going to show up in my new apartment with like every single thing that I need. Well, that just doesn't happen here. Right? So I think just moving a little slower, don't rush into things and like check things out before you decide where you want to commit long -term.

Yeah, that's a very good point to do it. Yeah, we do live in a the next day society where you know people do have things on on demand all the time and it's probably quite bad for your mental health just to be constantly switched on on constantly expecting things and having that chance to slow down have a Sunday off right? You just have a quick treat to have all the time but no one seems to have a Sunday off anymore and it's very useful for you just to be with nature or be with nothing leave your phone at home leave your watch at home just go for a walk

great. And then, you know, obviously you've set roots down with buying a house, everything, but would you consider moving somewhere else in the future or is Costa Rica now doing your own for the foreseeable? I, I see myself being here for a long time. My goal with Costa Rica was to drop my living expenses so that I would have more bandwidth to travel. you know,

James Doran (50:11.722)

If I don't have a mortgage payment, makes a lot more sense to pack up for a month and go to Ireland or something versus if you're paying a lot of rent or mortgage in a city, there's nothing left. You know, so I plan on being here, but I don't plan on staying here if that makes any sense, you know? Is it going to be your base? Yeah, exactly. And then you're use that as your kind of heavy pad to go everywhere else.

Cause it's a lovely place to come home to, know, perfect weather, big, I mean, it's nice. But when I, when I really want to, like I'm going to DC this week and I cannot wait to eat all weekend cause I miss so much food, you know, but then I'll be happy that I'll be so happy to come back here because DC is also really stressful. So this is an excellent place to come back to. What's the one thing you're going to look forward to eating when you, when you get back then what's that one thing that you looking forward to?

everything. DC does soul food really good. Fried chicken, biscuits, greens, know, all of the things that make your arteries clog. You know, that's my jam. You can always try to get a cheesesteak as well. That's a list too. And then looking kind of at your kind of advice for people who would be moving abroad themselves. So anywhere else, you know, who might leave the US, maybe in a similar situation where they can do a remote working job.

What advice might you give to them? Do it. Just, you know, my buddy has this, he's a life coach and is East Philly gin and he has this slogan, this is try life on. I think it's a great, you know, try it on, see if it works. You know, you don't have to go forever. Don't jump all the way in, but just give it a shot because you never know. And everything is possible. Not just anything, but everything is possible. And I think that, you know, life moves fast.

You know, and I decided that I wanted to make the next 20 the best 20 and that's what really pushed me out the door. So if you're feeling unfulfilled in your life and you're not really happy and you have this itch to go, do it. Do it. Just don't like sell everything you own and buy land before you get here. Just like, don't go into a manic episode, but like put your stuff in storage for a couple months and work it out. your house on Airbnb, co -

James Doran (52:29.26)

Listen to a friend or something, be smart about it and go check it out. Don't put off what happiness for a later date because it might never happen. That's a very, good point and very, very valuable. I love that slogan, Try Life On. very, very works so well. I hope it's on T -shirts somewhere. If not, it should be. be. Only one that fits. Otherwise it will be the correct slogan.

But yeah, no, that's beautiful. I really enjoyed that. And if you could give someone advice for the cost three guys specifically, what might you give them which would have worked in your country? Join the crime groups in all the neighborhoods that you're thinking about living in first because there's a real...

Problem with like victim blaming and if you talk about the crime here They remove you from the groups like people do not want their utopian dream to be disrupted and they will Shame you and delete your post and kick you out of groups just for telling the truth So when you moved to Costa Rica, if you just join the expats in North America and those types of groups You're just gonna get I love my neighborhood. I love my neighborhood

Well, I loved my neighborhood too until three men were in my house in ski masks. You know what I mean? So like, just because something hasn't happened to them doesn't mean that there's not crime happening all around them. So don't believe everybody because they will swear up and down that, Buddha Vida, I've lived here for 14 years. Never leave my phone everywhere. I'm like, that's wild because Costa Ricans like, you know, crime rate is out. I mean, it's like,

People live in two different planets. So if you're going to come here, join the crime groups for those areas so that you can properly educate yourself on where you want to live. Because there are certain areas right now in Costa Rica that are on fire. we're, you know, we're just in between Columbia and the United States. The cocaine superhighway. there's a lot of cartel stuff popping off right now. So I'm not saying it's a bad place live, but like you should understand where you live and educate yourself. Like I probably wouldn't move to Limon.

James Doran (54:50.136)

but I would be more likely to move to the west coast of Costa Rica, you know, but not certain parts, right? So like, just educate yourself a little bit and don't buy a house, don't sign a one -year lease. Like give yourself three months to like actually understand, you know, because you might think you want to live at the beach, but then you might realize the grocery store is too far and it's too hot and everything's too expensive, you know? So like give yourself that flexibility to figure that out before you commit.

to a long -term lease or any massive financial commitment. the crime groups, are they on Facebook or are they their websites or anything? Facebook? Facebook, yeah. And they'll tell you the real deal because they're like, you know, started by people who are actually reporting the crime and not the like tourist groups, you know what I mean? Full of realtors and people trying to sell you stuff and tell you how great Costa Rica is, you know what I mean?

Which it is, don't get me wrong, it is, but this is something that's happening. Just like I love DC. All kinds of crime happen in there too. Like that doesn't mean I hate DC. I'm not talking smack about DC, but it is super real there right now. You know what I mean? Like. It's a reality. It's not, it's not a utopia as said before. Yeah. Well, yeah, I guess there's anything more you wish to share about your life abroad or anything which you want to share with our listeners in terms of.

things they should do or apart from just do it or try life on. Well, you know, one of my favorite exercises is the perfect day exercise. It's pretty common. And you just really think about what would a perfect day look like? Like, where do you wake up? Do you lay in your bed for an hour? Do you work out? Do you read? Is it hot? Is it cold? What do you do for the first three hours of your day? How many hours a day do you want to work? Do you want to travel? Do you want to garden? Like really think about what it is you want.

and kind of try to remove all the obstacles that are preventing that from happening now. And just focus on what it is that you really want, which is hard. It's a really hard exercise because I think when you get really clear on what it is you want, it's a lot easier to reverse engineer it. And so my biggest recommendation is take a moment to put your phone in another room, turn everything off and sit someplace quiet and really think about what would your perfect day look like and then make it happen, you know, because it is possible.

James Doran (57:14.166)

No, it's a great bit of advice and probably some exercises online, which might help with that. Or I guess you want to avoid being online, but at least a framework to help ask those questions to begin with. Or for me, a perfect week would be somewhere to start. Cause I like to do different things each day. Yeah, exactly. Same. Yeah. It's a great way of packaging. And I'm very much a person who believes in gratitude and try to say thank you for the things. And my girlfriend's been a really good...

inspiration for me to do that and we've done this thing where we write ourselves a letter one month in the future and one year in the future and just try and say what we've already achieved and you know even if it doesn't happen it's still nice to think positive in a world where we're kind of told I think that's wrong, suppose, I think that goes right which is good and yeah the realistic expectation of things take time, things don't happen overnight so it's quite useful as I'm finding out with this podcast you know

to my 10 listeners is great. Now it's 11. You got 11 now. Slow and steady. Wonderful. I don't know if you want to share about your own business work or anything else you want to kind of work with people to find you or talk to you or if anyone wants to kind of get in touch and ask you questions directly. Yeah, sure. The website is Heartcast Media. Like heart, like you're beating heart and like podcast Heartcast Media.

And you know, you can see all our services there and there's a contact form and then of course people can find me on LinkedIn or or Instagram or whatever, know contents a little different but I'm always happy to answer people's questions, especially women that are thinking about moving abroad, you know But yeah, you know hit me up anytime. I'm happy to answer any questions or be useful Well, thank you so much and I've really really enjoyed your your view on on life. It's been quite

refreshing to see someone who's after such a horrible start perhaps you've really embraced it which hasn't really hindered you I think which is probably improved your experience because you've been that more I guess real or mindful of what's going on or tend to which is great so thank you and as always if you have enjoyed the podcast please do give it a subscribe please do share with your friends and

James Doran (59:34.274)

As always, we'll see you next time for the expert pod.